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vianegativaThis is the final post on the matter of Jack.
I'm actually glad I did the rash thing and called him after our flurry of comments this evening. I was so frustrated, I could barely speak, but I needed to call because I felt the format of LJ was pretty insufficient. I know I must have sounded like an unintelligible wreck because I'd often only let out a *grah*. The important thing was he talked, and I listened.
Essentially, we're not going to be friends because in his opinion I had lost interest in him. He came to this conclusion because we had stopped talking online and he had then run with that scenario to to put me in the place of every man who has ever dissapointed or lied to him.
Logic was useless of course. He had his mind set, and no matter what point I offered it was insufficient. He cited our lack of communication, but didn't stop to think that our primary means of talking which was online during the day, had been blocked by his own employer. He cited my one and only cancellation with him and my illnesses earlier this year as a form of excuse; I got the feeling that he thought I staged these. Anyone who knows me in real life knows otherwise, as they had to hear me bitch about work first-hand or ferry me to the doctor for both flu & strep. He even admitted he may have jumped the gun when I contacted him today to make dinner plans for tomorrow.
Over & over in the conversation he'd say "I saw the writing on the wall, so I decided to end it" and "Put your hand on a stove once & you'll learn not to be burned" while complaining that I was inaccurate in guessing he'd been hurt before or then telling me "all the other guys said they weren't like the others, too." At one point, he actually told me his interactions with others in his past weren't coloring his decision to cease talking to me after he told me (paraphrasing) "he knew how this thing would turn out." At the end, he hung up on me as I tried to tell him I did wish he found happiness. Earlier in the conversation he told me I was lying because if I was angry at him I couldn't possibly wish him well.
I'm really glad of this. It saved me a lot of time.
In the past I'd pursue someone like this, try to be their friend, and waste countless hours addressing their inadequacies, assuming I did something wrong and hurt them or did some miniscule thing wrong that upset them. He saved me from wasting time trying to befriend someone dead set on being unhappy.
The truth of the matter was he stopped talking to me based on an opinion. He played out our entire history in his head without any real regard for how I might really react and then decided I would hurt him, so it'd be best to cut ties now. My friendship essentially drew breath, flourished, then burned all within his head. No matter what I could say, it was a lost cause. No amount of logic or reason could shake his conviction of the fact that I was just like everyone else who hurt him. He had never met me face-to-face, but already he thought he knew me. How can anyone fight that?
Here's the grand finale. He thought our friendship would end badly, and was so set on believing that, so coiled around negativity and a need to justify his view of people as selfish avenues of harm, that he wouldn't listen to anything else. Despite my reaching out to him, he squelched a potential friendship because he thought it might go badly. I can't fight expectations, and I'm too tired to argue away fear.
Oh, and Jack? If you knew me, I mean REALLY knew me, you'd know this: I can wish you well because no matter our interaction, I don't have time for spite. I hope you find some good friends out there because you missed out on a loyal, caring one here. I could go into why, but why bother. You wouldn't listen.
Somehow though, I'm thinking you won't. That's just my opinion, though.
I'm actually glad I did the rash thing and called him after our flurry of comments this evening. I was so frustrated, I could barely speak, but I needed to call because I felt the format of LJ was pretty insufficient. I know I must have sounded like an unintelligible wreck because I'd often only let out a *grah*. The important thing was he talked, and I listened.
Essentially, we're not going to be friends because in his opinion I had lost interest in him. He came to this conclusion because we had stopped talking online and he had then run with that scenario to to put me in the place of every man who has ever dissapointed or lied to him.
Logic was useless of course. He had his mind set, and no matter what point I offered it was insufficient. He cited our lack of communication, but didn't stop to think that our primary means of talking which was online during the day, had been blocked by his own employer. He cited my one and only cancellation with him and my illnesses earlier this year as a form of excuse; I got the feeling that he thought I staged these. Anyone who knows me in real life knows otherwise, as they had to hear me bitch about work first-hand or ferry me to the doctor for both flu & strep. He even admitted he may have jumped the gun when I contacted him today to make dinner plans for tomorrow.
Over & over in the conversation he'd say "I saw the writing on the wall, so I decided to end it" and "Put your hand on a stove once & you'll learn not to be burned" while complaining that I was inaccurate in guessing he'd been hurt before or then telling me "all the other guys said they weren't like the others, too." At one point, he actually told me his interactions with others in his past weren't coloring his decision to cease talking to me after he told me (paraphrasing) "he knew how this thing would turn out." At the end, he hung up on me as I tried to tell him I did wish he found happiness. Earlier in the conversation he told me I was lying because if I was angry at him I couldn't possibly wish him well.
I'm really glad of this. It saved me a lot of time.
In the past I'd pursue someone like this, try to be their friend, and waste countless hours addressing their inadequacies, assuming I did something wrong and hurt them or did some miniscule thing wrong that upset them. He saved me from wasting time trying to befriend someone dead set on being unhappy.
The truth of the matter was he stopped talking to me based on an opinion. He played out our entire history in his head without any real regard for how I might really react and then decided I would hurt him, so it'd be best to cut ties now. My friendship essentially drew breath, flourished, then burned all within his head. No matter what I could say, it was a lost cause. No amount of logic or reason could shake his conviction of the fact that I was just like everyone else who hurt him. He had never met me face-to-face, but already he thought he knew me. How can anyone fight that?
Here's the grand finale. He thought our friendship would end badly, and was so set on believing that, so coiled around negativity and a need to justify his view of people as selfish avenues of harm, that he wouldn't listen to anything else. Despite my reaching out to him, he squelched a potential friendship because he thought it might go badly. I can't fight expectations, and I'm too tired to argue away fear.
Oh, and Jack? If you knew me, I mean REALLY knew me, you'd know this: I can wish you well because no matter our interaction, I don't have time for spite. I hope you find some good friends out there because you missed out on a loyal, caring one here. I could go into why, but why bother. You wouldn't listen.
Somehow though, I'm thinking you won't. That's just my opinion, though.
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no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 05:00 am (UTC)I get it. Despite the fact that this final rant of yours wasn't even faintly what we discussed on the phone, I intend this to be my last post here. You continue to misunderstand what I was saying. I'd have been just fine without you calling me to sputter 15 minutes of nervous energy into my ear.
I surrender. You *are* the warmhearted cuddly gentleman everyone knows and loves. You're treasured by your bevy of bears. Are we through, now, airing the dirty laundry? I've already received two threats of violence and a fuckload of personal insults for nothing more than making a decision about you based upon my past experiences and your recent behavior.
Can you. Please. Let. It. Drop.
no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 05:15 am (UTC)This "rant" was our conversation. Period. If you had a thought inside your head aside from wallowing in how cruel men have been to you in the past you might realize that if I didn't give a damn about you I wouldn't have bothered calling to try & talk.
I don't care what you think (at least not anymore). I'm working this out myself, in my journal, and it would have been dropped had you NOT BLOODY COMMENTED ON IT. Did you not read the "This is the final post on the matter of Jack" line or were you too busy preparing a response?
As I said, this is the last of this discussion.
no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 05:54 am (UTC)Ya know, if you really felt that way, would you have even bothered posting that?
Now i'm sorry I missed all the whining and "Oh gawd!" shit the two of you went through earlier.
And no, i'm not sayin Matt is right. Just saying you both need to STFU. You'll probably take that the wrong way and whine like a fuckin pussy. Matt. I hope you still know me well enough to take it on the chin.
Oh, and by the fucking way. Before you start acting the goddamned matyr. If you'd kept yer fuckin mouth shut..no one woulda known who teh fuck you are. Now you've annoyed people AND they know yer LJ name. But i'm SURE thats someone elses fault too, right?
Matt, you're a mess, always have been. But you're a FUNCTIONAL mess. So it's perfectly acceptable.
no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 06:22 am (UTC)Just FYI...
Date: 2006-02-09 07:05 am (UTC)Re: Just FYI...
Date: 2006-02-09 07:07 am (UTC)Re: Just FYI...
Date: 2006-02-09 07:09 am (UTC)Re: Just FYI...
Date: 2006-02-09 12:15 pm (UTC)Point being, you could have researched it, yes, but he jumped right in and said "here I am". Moreover, this is the only venue he took the time to communicate in; if you are only going to use LJ to communicate, expect the explosions that can go with it.
no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 05:50 am (UTC)*HUGS* :)
no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 06:23 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-02-09 01:38 pm (UTC)I feel very bad for him and for you, partly because he's in such an unhealthy space. Partly because it's completely understandable what path may have taken him to that space.
And partly because - and the smart ones in the room have already figured this out - I see a bit of myself in his response.
Breathe.